The Last Jedi

[jrfox92]

Yeah, but what did your 5-year-old think of the original trilogy?

[codetocontra]

Or the prequels?

[MechaGodzilla]

Or the prequels?

what do any of the rabid TLJ haters think about the prequels? (not saying that everyone who has problems with it is a rabid, but they're out there)

[Mudfuzz]

Or the prequels?

what do any of the rabid TLJ haters think about the prequels? (not saying that everyone who has problems with it is a rabid, but they're out there)

People that like the prequels is proof of human deevolution....
I haven't see tlj yet so I don't know if I hate it... Yet... It's got to be better than the last one.. Whatever it was called.. And if going by that one and a Han Solo movie in the future.... I'm going hold out for that live action remake on the xmas special...

[goroth]

Saw TLJ last night.
I really liked it.

Prequels may be some of the worst films ever made. Right up there with The Room.

Dialogue is painfully bad (even lowering my expectations to "blockbuster scifi franchise" level)
Casting and acting is mostly shit
Plots are fucked.
CGI everywhere. EVERYWHERE! And it was apparently done for free by users of deviantart.
Ruined (literally) the whole concept of the Force.
Skywalker = Jesus storyline also total shithouse.

That's just to start with.

Anyways, back to TLJ - haven't reflected over it much, but I thought it was pretty great.

[Snufkino]

In retrospect, I'll give credit to the Phantom Menace since it had moments that actually felt like a Star Wars film, which weirdly, the Force Awakens kind of failed at despite just being a rehash of the original. With the Ghostly Scare, there was the Pod Racing and the fight with Darth Maul with that do-do-doodaloo music, but that's about it. The second one had Christopher Lee as an evil Jedi, and he had a cool looking light saber, and the third one had that neat bit where Anakin gets his legs cut off and almost rolls into a volcano. The only redeeming point they shared was Ian Mcdiarmid who I could listen to all day, especially in full panto villain mode. Apart from those points they were garbage. All I remember about the Force Awakens was the sound design of Kylo's voice and lightsaber, and that comedy bit where Rey is telling Finn (?) "No. No. That one. The one I'm pointing at" but it felt more like a million dollar fan fiction than anything "legitimate".

I don't think I'll bother with this new one, mainly because SpaceRitual's comment:

"Were going to make it clear that we could have gone one direction and initially started to do that but abruptly changed our minds and just made up some boring shit to pad it out to three hours"

Sounds like a fair summary and almost what I kind of expected. I'll wait for someone to upload the cool bits onto youtube. Kamakazi at lightspeed (nothing says Star Wars like suicide bombers!), Luke wanking off an alien boob, Luke maybe getting busy with his lightsaber, and saying to Rey "Come with me if you want to live". Oh, sorry, wrong reboot/sequel.

That and I just remembered that I actively dislike Rian Jonson's films. If it wasn't for the prentious novelty of Brick, nobody would know who he was. Looper looks awful, is horribly paced, feels like it's made up from three separate twilight zone episodes, none of which quite work. Also I think he helped make whatshisface, that kid from 3rd rock from the sun, into more of a hollywood star, which I also don't like. He's like the result of someone trying to clone James Franco. A good looking, all singing-all-dancing guy who can remember his lines and handle his coke. I bet he's in this too as the voice of a fucking vending machine or something. Fuck that.

[CrookedRainJr]

Absolutely hated this movie, I say that as a huge Star Wars fan (Empire is even my favorite movie ever) and have seen the first showing of all of them since Episode 2. Quick bullet points:

1) We still know absolutely nothing about Snoke or the rise of The First Order, or how Snoke was even able to manipulate Kylo Ren. Or how Maz got Luke's lightsaber from Empire Strikes Back. The fact the movie just shrugs and pretends none of those are important details after two movies is just baffling.
2) How useless is Snoke? So he's apparently this huge monster clearly strong with the force, yet gets taken down in roughly the second scene we see of him. Laughable main villain. We still knew nothing about him.
3) Kylo Ren is able to turn on a lightsaber with his mind and Snoke apparently couldn't see it coming because reasons. This completely contradicts past movies. Hey, remember that legend Luke Skywalker? You know, the guy apparently stronger than his nephew. Remember in his situation with Palpatine? Probably could have flicked the switch on there. Or when Obi-Wan was on the ledge in Phantom Menace, could have just turned the lightsaber on and cut Darth Maul's fucking feet off.
4) Leia is able to coast along in space because more reasons. I'm sorry, it's absolutely stupid and if you actually try to defend it more power to you.
5) The Finn and Rose stuff is entirely useless to the plot. The codebreaker is seen once, then they are somehow able to find an even better codebreaker who is somehow able to sneak off and tell the First Order their plan. Rose didn't really add anything to the movie, I think they just wanted to have an even more diverse cast.
6) Why the fuck didn't they just tell Poe the plan instead of creating turmoil on the ship over it? I mean, the fuck were they gaining not telling people? They made a big deal about how few people they had left, and all of them were escaping. So naturally this experienced leader trained by Leia just feels it's best to come across as a total bitch and shitty captain to keep it a surprise.
7) EVERYONE IS A FUCKING COMEDIAN. Leave that shit in the Avengers. There are way too many quips and one liners and they all fall flat. "Wipe that expression off your face Threepio!" "I'm sure you don't recognize me, I changed my hair." Even when it's not them trying to be Star Wars Avengers, the humor just doesn't belong. The "do you feel the force?" leaf scene with Luke and Rey actually had my theater audience groaning.
8) The opening "on hold for Hux" bit might be the worst scene in Star Wars. It's so forced and doesn't feel like it belongs in the universe, which was also a problem I had with some lines and scenes in Force Awakens.
9) No final duel. Sure, we get that Kylo and Rey scene taking down the guards (Are they the other Knights of Ren? Not going to explain that? What a surprise), but every movie is built up to a final conflict between two characters. Luke VS Kylo had all these elements to make it one of the best scenes in the franchise after Force Awakens yet we're robbed of it here.

The mood of the audiences leaving after those first showings was just dead silent. Nobody seemed excited. For the best film franchise ever, they sure have had more bad movies than good ones at this point.

[reckon luck]

Here are some guys that talk about the movie for a while. I agree with some of their points.
[youtube][/youtube]


I enjoyed TLJ, I wouldn't mind seeing it again, but the more I think about it, the more confused I get. I'm just amazed at how poorly it's constructed. How many people at Disney signed off on this thing?

[neonblack]

^^^ AND liked it enough to give Rian his own trilogy.

I honestly think it could be awesome if they let him do his thing with it. I honestly think the Mouseheads probably had a lot to do with the questionable decisions. Johnson obviously wanted to break away from the Skywalker thing and the generic light vs dark conflict to open the universe up for more interesting stories. I respect what he wanted to do with the franchise, and I still legitimately enjoyed the movie, warts and all.

[popvulture]

I didn't think it was bad, just definitely wasn't good either. The biggest issue I had was with expectations... the prequels obv blew, and Force Awakens, rehash though it was, was sorta needed as a return to form (or at least it felt that way). That paved the way for TLJ, which I imagined as the big chance to really do something awesome... great director, plenty of chances to create a ton of plot tensions to deal with in the finale. But nope, really not a lot of any of that. Just kinda more of the same...

I know it's been said plenty, but this is why I think Rogue One was so great. Wasn't really beholden to much, just had to make some distant connections to the bigger plot—therefore it had a lot of freedom to live on its own and just be fresh and exciting. No bullshit. I hope future SW properties can kinda have a little more of that freedom once they past the three big trilogies.

[MechaGodzilla]

The more I see people hating on TLJ for irrational reasons the more I love it.

[gnomethrone]

[Benn Roe]

3) Kylo Ren is able to turn on a lightsaber with his mind and Snoke apparently couldn't see it coming because reasons. This completely contradicts past movies. Hey, remember that legend Luke Skywalker? You know, the guy apparently stronger than his nephew. Remember in his situation with Palpatine? Probably could have flicked the switch on there. Or when Obi-Wan was on the ledge in Phantom Menace, could have just turned the lightsaber on and cut Darth Maul's fucking feet off.
4) Leia is able to coast along in space because more reasons. I'm sorry, it's absolutely stupid and if you actually try to defend it more power to you.

I don't disagree with most of your points, but I may be able to offer some insight on these two.

They haven't dwelled on it much in the movies, but different force-sensitives definitely specialize in different areas of the force and can use the force in different or more powerful ways. Vader specialized in force choking, Palpatine and Dooku are the only people I remember using force lightning (until Yoda, kinda), Ezra Bridger can control animals, etc. It's possible Kylo's mastery of the fine manipulation of telekinesis is just stronger than average, even if he pales in comparison to Luke's power overall (which isn't clear, to be honest). Also, let's be fair, during the original trilogy Luke grew to be very goody-goody Jedi-minded. Even if he had the telekinetic fine manipulation and the idea to kill Palpatine the way Kylo killed Snoke, he probably wouldn't have done it because it's a very dark-side thing to do and pretty out of character for him at the time.

Leia has been hinted to be force-sensitive since Empire Strikes Back ("no, there is another"). We've never seen her use the force on-screen, and frankly she just doesn't seem to have much use for it, but there have been other non-movie examples of force-sensitives using their connection to the force to give them limited protection from the vacuum of space. Plo Koon did it in an early Clone Wars episode, for instance, and even did all the exposition people are missing here. Telekinesis is one of the primary ways people use the force, so Leia shrouding herself in a teke shield and pulling herself toward the ship is in keeping with tradition. She just seemed to do it subconsciously, likely a testament to the strength of her connection to the force, because of that sweet, sweet Skywalker blood.

[neonblack]

Kylo also stopped a blaster shot in mid air in TFA. I didn't even bat an eye at the saber thing. I mean, shit, it's just a button on the handle.

[gnomethrone]

THE FORCE ISN'T ABOUT MOVING ROCKS YOU GUYS